Blueskies12 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 5 hours ago, Iamferalz said: @Blueskies12 the land has been occupied by various empires over many hundreds of years. The Palestinians have lived in the land for a long period of time whereas the Jews who were displaced by the Romans and ended up all over the world only returned relatively recently. The British came up with an idea to divvy it up between them for its own selfish reasons and they eventually withdrew. After WW2 and the Holocaust the Jews felt there was no safe country for them and a lot of countries had shut their doors to them during the Holocaust including Australia. So that was the context in which the UN had a vote on whether to create both a Palestinian and Jewish state in the land. The vote got passed. However, most Arabic countries rejected it and immediately invaded Israel. Then since then there has been a number of wars, atrocities and extremists on both sides, as we see today. It has not been resolved and it really comes down to what the British decided in 1917. The British have form for creating borders like that across its former empire. Iran’s involvement is more complicated. It has been trying to export its particular ideology of Islam via the Muslim Brotherhood type movement and proxy armies. Hamas was one of their supported movements. Hezbollah in Lebanon is a proxy Iranian army and has its weapons supplied by them. Also the Houthis in Yemen. It’s created instability elsewhere in the Middle East in general. That’s pretty much why even though the West is uncomfortable with Israel’s post 7th October actions it supports Israel. And as Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel since October 7th the Israelis killed their leader and invaded Lebanon. Iran is now sending missiles to Israel, as Hezbollah was their baby. So the ordinary Palestinian and Lebanese people have been caught up in this. Many Israelis also do not support Netanyahu, who is in coalition with some very right wing religious Jews who want more land to settle on. Many Lebanese are Christians and moderate Muslims and do not like Hezbollah in their midst. So lots of innocent people are caught in between. I feel sorry for them all. Thank you. Thank you for your generous and thoughtful response. It means a lot to me. I feel out of my depth, and knowledge is helpful. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplekitty Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 How odd that Netanyahu is increasing destabilisation of the Middle East leading up to the US election. If elected Trump will be making his wishes for Israel, and Putin's wishes for Ukraine come true. 3 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crombek Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 2 hours ago, Blueskies12 said: Thank you. Thank you for your generous and thoughtful response. It means a lot to me. I feel out of my depth, and knowledge is helpful. It is really complicated & I certainly don't have my head around the thousands of years of warfare in the area. But without a doubt this didn't begin last Oct and without a doubt the West are taking advantage, and have been for a very long time. If nothing else what has come to light is that the US can no longer fool people into believing they are the World's Police, and aren't any better than the Brits, Russians & Germans. Like the Romans, Greeks & Ottomans before them. To be human is to be colonised, apparently. 2 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LemonMyrtle Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 2 hours ago, purplekitty said: How odd that Netanyahu is increasing destabilisation of the Middle East leading up to the US election. If elected Trump will be making his wishes for Israel, and Putin's wishes for Ukraine come true. Both sides of US politics support Israel though, don’t they? I don’t think the US election is much of a consideration for Israel. They are arrogant enough, and history has proven, that the US won’t stop funding them any time soon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sincerely Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 1 hour ago, Crombek said: It is really complicated & I certainly don't have my head around the thousands of years of warfare in the area. But without a doubt this didn't begin last Oct and without a doubt the West are taking advantage, and have been for a very long time. If nothing else what has come to light is that the US can no longer fool people into believing they are the World's Police, and aren't any better than the Brits, Russians & Germans. Like the Romans, Greeks & Ottomans before them. To be human is to be colonised, apparently. In their cases, to be human is to insatiably crave and pursue power by conquering others and taking their resources. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplekitty Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 1 hour ago, LemonMyrtle said: Both sides of US politics support Israel though, don’t they? I don’t think the US election is much of a consideration for Israel. They are arrogant enough, and history has proven, that the US won’t stop funding them any time soon. Netanyahu went and saw Trump recently. Have look at Trump's statements in the last 24 hours. Despite the US not restraining Israel to the extent we all would like, they always are/have been applying pressure in the background. They walk a fine line. Nobody wants what will happen if the region melts down and major countries like the USA and Russia really get involved. Don't underestimate Russia's machinations in the background. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamferalz Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 @purplekitty I was wondering how other countries will get involved. Apparently the UK, France and Jordan got involved in defending Israel from Iran’s bombardment, not just the US. If Trump gets in who knows what will happen, as he has a bromance with Putin, who supports Iran. Trump was berating US Jews recently for not supporting him enough. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrankyM Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 I see Israel is yet again targeting health and medical facilities in the same pattern of the type of attacks they followed in Gaza. Are they going to cry Hamas/Hezbollah again? Because it's a bloody war crime to target medical facilities. But then again, no one seems to be pulling them up and our outrage seems to do nothing. I don't think any god they believe in is going to judge them nicely. 2 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplekitty Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 2 hours ago, Iamferalz said: @purplekitty I was wondering how other countries will get involved. Apparently the UK, France and Jordan got involved in defending Israel from Iran’s bombardment, not just the US. If Trump gets in who knows what will happen, as he has a bromance with Putin, who supports Iran. Trump was berating US Jews recently for not supporting him enough. It's frightening because the players now are sociopaths, the rules seem to be no longer existent. Chaos sees to be fine with them and their plans. Men fighting for their personal survival and power rather than some interest in their countries well being. The dysfunction of many of the more stabilising governments over the last few years has left a vacuum in international power. Thanks largely to Russia ,techbros and billionaires for that. It is depressing that voters don't see them for what they are. 5 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictorineTheCatLover Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 It's just distressing really. Was discussing with my mum last night about how bad it is and how much worse it's going to get. We have opposing views on the whole situation etc and she then said " I suppose it's a good thing our children aren't being bombed" I replied with "You do remember MY child is over there yeah?" *crickets* 1 9 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunaFreya Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 The leopards aren't eating their faces... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightningMcqueen Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 That’s only one of the big tragedies of this whole thing - it’s become so clear that some lives are given more value than others. @VictorineTheCatLover, I hope your child is safe and ok 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictorineTheCatLover Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 Just now, LightningMcqueen said: That’s only one of the big tragedies of this whole thing - it’s become so clear that some lives are given more value than others. @VictorineTheCatLover, I hope your child is safe and ok He is currently but all it will take is one stray rocket or misfire during what he may have to do..... I can't help but be angry at those who have stayed when told to leave. I understand every reason they can give hut seriously?!! Bloody leave!! 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LemonMyrtle Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 Im just so angry at the US, they could have avoided so much of this if they had just said “that’s enough” months ago when Gaza was being bombed. their leadership has silenced som many other countries, Australia included, and given Israel free reign to commit genocide. And now it’s escalated. It was inevitable, but could have been tempered with some decent world leadership. I doubt the US could have stopped anything, but they could have lessened it all. i just can’t believe the world has just stood back and watched this all happen. I just don’t get it. 2 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrankyM Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 7 minutes ago, LemonMyrtle said: i just can’t believe the world has just stood back and watched this all happen. I just don’t get it. Yeah I don't either. It does however give me a better understanding of the previous world wars and how no one seemed to do anything to prevent some of the aspects of them. But I'm losing any faith I had in humanity over this. And that countries as a whole don't really care about others unless it involves money, resources or hate. 7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LemonMyrtle Posted October 5 Share Posted October 5 USA “yeah, sure, bomb whoever you want, we will even lob a few at Yemen for you. Muslims aren’t people anyway. No worries. Just, don’t bomb the oil, ok? We like oil” 2 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Bicycle Posted October 6 Share Posted October 6 France has stopped weapon exports to Israel and calling for other countries to do the same. https://www.9news.com.au/world/israel-conflict-president-emmanual-macron-called-for-halt-to-arms-shipments-to-israel/c89c9fe6-9758-487d-a0fc-e2eb68a86a76 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VictorineTheCatLover Posted Wednesday at 06:58 AM Share Posted Wednesday at 06:58 AM You know...the more I read the more I think that those in charge in Israel allowed this to happen. Carelessly or deliberately? We'll never know and they'll never admit it. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/oct/07/intelligence-failures-before-7-october-attack-hamas-israel-gaza https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-10-08/israel-beeri-massacre-october-7-anniversary-residents-resistance/104417098?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3v3ZZKJLnqLDAHf1qLqMcQyuX5-MgxIPnO4X3oc9SSuagJngHnXs6AH7k_aem_JtL0BTH8iWWATr6RkdyI4g It's frightening to read how let down the Israeli's were that were in direct harms way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Bicycle Posted Wednesday at 07:01 AM Share Posted Wednesday at 07:01 AM Just now, VictorineTheCatLover said: You know...the more I read the more I think that those in charge in Israel allowed this to happen. Carelessly or deliberately? We'll never know and they'll never admit it. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/oct/07/intelligence-failures-before-7-october-attack-hamas-israel-gaza https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-10-08/israel-beeri-massacre-october-7-anniversary-residents-resistance/104417098?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3v3ZZKJLnqLDAHf1qLqMcQyuX5-MgxIPnO4X3oc9SSuagJngHnXs6AH7k_aem_JtL0BTH8iWWATr6RkdyI4g It's frightening to read how let down the Israeli's were that were in direct harms way. Especially the care and time taken to intercept those pagers and hand held radios and place explosives. Yes, some top level heads might of been replaced after October 7th, but the agents in the ground would be the same, and that operation was complex. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplekitty Posted Wednesday at 08:39 AM Share Posted Wednesday at 08:39 AM It's hard to comprehend when Mossad has always been considered one of the most efficient and capable intelligence agencies in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplekitty Posted 1 hour ago Share Posted 1 hour ago Israel attacking UN peacekeepers in Lebanon now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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